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 Post subject: obama stuff
PostPosted: January 20th, 2009, 5:56 pm 
ASSHOLE
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http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2009/raci ... -0120.html

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 Post subject: Re: obama stuff
PostPosted: January 20th, 2009, 6:16 pm 
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Interesting read, and I don't think you meant to imply this, but I don't really see the fact that he won as a result of getting black voters active as a bad thing. The fact of the matter is that while a lot of non-white voters may have changed their vote because he was black, I would bet that MORE non-white voters voted this year than did so in previous years, and that's what ultimately made the difference. The more people voting, the better the election!

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 Post subject: Re: obama stuff
PostPosted: January 21st, 2009, 5:12 am 
ASSHOLE
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Absolutely, but in what will become a tidal wave of analysis, it's nice to see a better use of numbers and statistics than most news organizations will utilize.

Even if it's only at first, and we can hope, this will probably only serve to inflame racial differences, as people go on record making sweeping statements and generalizations. I had a long talk with a sociologist (a hardcore social relativist...*puke*) yesterday, and she was adamant that there is no such thing as race, to even refer to skin color is unacceptable, etc. [ie, humans are gentically the same, skin color is just a single phenotype, race implies genotypic difference, etc. It's called science people, use it.] Yeaaaah.

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 Post subject: Re: obama stuff
PostPosted: January 22nd, 2009, 3:13 pm 
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greekrefugee wrote:
[ie, humans are gentically the same, skin color is just a single phenotype, race implies genotypic difference, etc.


Tim Wise


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 Post subject: Re: obama stuff
PostPosted: January 23rd, 2009, 1:41 pm 

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Maybe I assume people are more informed than they are (probably), but it seems to me that "studies" like this just have WAAAAYYYYY to many variables to draw any sort of conclusion. I mean, it's not like in previous presidential elections, it was John McCain vs. a guy exactly like Obama but white. Even when you abstract it to just be Democrat vs. Republican, the parties' platforms change, as do the major issues they are pushing, along with the general climate of the majority. It just seems like there are too many variables and nothing approaching a control to get any real conclusions out of it.

Now this all assumes that people were actually informed enough to know about what the parties' platforms were, what the issues in the country were, what the candidates planned to do about them, etc, and didn't just go "YO LATOYA! WE GOTS TA GO VOTE FOR DA BRUTHA!"

I guess the exit poll data they say they carefully analyzed could paint a clearer picture, but they don't say what it was for you to really be able to get an idea for yourself.
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 Post subject: Re: obama stuff
PostPosted: January 27th, 2009, 9:47 am 
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http://chicagoagainstobama.wordpress.co ... or-my-gas/

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 Post subject: Re: obama stuff
PostPosted: February 7th, 2009, 5:14 pm 
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Mirkendargen wrote:
Now this all assumes that people were actually informed enough to know about what the parties' platforms were, what the issues in the country were, what the candidates planned to do about them, etc, and didn't just go "YO LATOYA! WE GOTS TA GO VOTE FOR DA BRUTHA!"



This is the case every election. Not always with the blacks but with quite a few old white veterans(Just blacks are more in the spotlight this year because of Obama). My dad has no clue politically whats going on but will always vote republican just because he will always view Democrats as a bunch of pot smoking hippies that want to destroy the country.

Our system is flawed either way you look at it. Saying you give someone a choice in voting when you are still narrowed down to 2 decisions (don't kid yourself about the Independents) is still a flawed system. Most of the time you aren't even voting for the best choice as president but the lesser of 2 evils.

A small solution would be just getting rid of the party nominations. Would have been interesting to see who would have won with Huckabe, McCaine, Paul, Clinton, Edwards and all the others on the ballot.

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 Post subject: Re: obama stuff
PostPosted: February 12th, 2009, 3:08 am 

Joined: May 30th, 2007, 11:42 am
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greekrefugee wrote:
Absolutely, but in what will become a tidal wave of analysis, it's nice to see a better use of numbers and statistics than most news organizations will utilize.

Even if it's only at first, and we can hope, this will probably only serve to inflame racial differences, as people go on record making sweeping statements and generalizations. I had a long talk with a sociologist (a hardcore social relativist...*puke*) yesterday, and she was adamant that there is no such thing as race, to even refer to skin color is unacceptable, etc. [ie, humans are gentically the same, skin color is just a single phenotype, race implies genotypic difference, etc. It's called science people, use it.] Yeaaaah.


Ethnicity != Race. It is unacceptable (race) from an academic standpoint but not in modern culture anyway. The usage of race is so broad, sweeping and flawed it isn't really funny. Especially considering the ideas like social Darwinism that have existed and many people still believe in today. Not only science but the humanities have disproved most of the persistent stereotypes and classifications.
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 Post subject: Re: obama stuff
PostPosted: February 12th, 2009, 5:06 am 
ASSHOLE
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No doubt about ethnicity != race. I cannot, however, buy into the notion that there is no such thing as race. It seems an ever-present factor, even if you want to define it as a purely social construct (an idea I'm mostly comfortable with, but not completely). Our brains are hard-wired to process novel information and to immediately categorize it. Now, the trick is obviously using said amazingly evolved human brain to not extend visual sense-data categories to generalizations about the person. Not a huge logical or practical jump, but it's easy to see why it can happen. I'm always just loathe to insist on solutions that ignore science (in this case the bio/cog sci aspect of perception), and not because of the stupid idea many have that the natural sciences somehow outweigh the social, but because of a general appeal to holism. And yes, Social Darwinism is straight up retarded. Anyway, this is a massive topic, and now I'm running late, lol. I have to poop, shave my twig and two berries, shower and pack my lunch in 24 minutes. Damn you!

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 Post subject: Re: obama stuff
PostPosted: February 14th, 2009, 6:59 am 

Joined: May 29th, 2007, 7:12 pm
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Location: San Jose
Hits911 wrote:
This is the case every election. Not always with the blacks but with quite a few old white veterans(Just blacks are more in the spotlight this year because of Obama). My dad has no clue politically whats going on but will always vote republican just because he will always view Democrats as a bunch of pot smoking hippies that want to destroy the country.

Our system is flawed either way you look at it. Saying you give someone a choice in voting when you are still narrowed down to 2 decisions (don't kid yourself about the Independents) is still a flawed system. Most of the time you aren't even voting for the best choice as president but the lesser of 2 evils.

A small solution would be just getting rid of the party nominations. Would have been interesting to see who would have won with Huckabe, McCaine, Paul, Clinton, Edwards and all the others on the ballot.


Democracy is actually a highly flawed system because of the irrationalities of human nature.
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